Talk: E/A Dancing MoM

Revision as of 07:56, 5 December 2007

Nice hax getting deadly arts rune on an E/A, also, why only 10 deadly? O.o --Edru viransu//QQ about me/sysop 23:13, 1 October 2007 (CEST)

oops, didn't notice that, forgot to change it from standard template, thanks for pointing that out. - Sommunn R 23:58, 1 October 2007 (CEST)

You need a long recharge non-deadly arts skill to get better results off of MoM. Maybe even drop res for something too. --Edru viransu//QQ about me/sysop 00:02, 2 October 2007 (CEST)

Yea, I was thinking of throwing Shadow Fang in there before, but it seems kind of random. If its used without Deadly Paradox its really effective for energy management.- Sommunn R 00:09, 2 October 2007 (CEST)

Why does the long recharge skill have to be non-deadly? MoM only means other energy storage skills.- Sommunn R 00:18, 2 October 2007 (CEST)

That is what the description would indicate, but it actually gives energy for each recharging skill that doesn't share the spell you cast's attribute. --Edru viransu//QQ about me/sysop 00:21, 2 October 2007 (CEST)

Never knew that, thanks. how about Shroud of Distress without using Deadly paradox with it? - Sommunn R 00:26, 2 October 2007 (CEST)

Perhaps a stance like Dark Escape so it would cancel Deadly Paradox automatically. You attributes could then be Ene=10+1+1 dead=12 sha=8. I think it would be okay, cept you would have to activate Deadly Paradox again before using assassin skills.

۷ïεדИǺмЄŠЄ. 00:31, 2 October 2007 (CEST)

Energy Blast also helps with the energy gain since its not the same attribute as Dancing Daggers. I think I'll put that in the main bar. - Sommunn R 01:04, 2 October 2007 (CEST)

Magnetic Aura lolololo –Ichigo724 23:20, 2 October 2007 (CEST)

wow that is ridiculously long. Maybe for AB verson, Glyph of Sacrifice + Magnetic Aura. You'd be set for a long time. - Sommunn R 00:24, 3 October 2007 (CEST)

Leave any major changes you want me to make soon, I think I'll move it to testing in 3-5 days. - Sommunn R 00:29, 3 October 2007 (CEST)

This build was posted be4 and you guys unfavored it...16:11, 4 October 2007 (CEST)~

Yep, was my build and the reason was because it was too similar to a stone dagger spammer... Was already planning to submit it myself but it seems some1 did it be4 me.

Dark Morphon 17:01, 4 October 2007 (CEST)

Ohj a suggestion: take out two points in E-storage, put em in earth magic and add Kinetic Armor. 12 E-storage is the breakpoint, so you'll have enough E-storage and the problem with low armor is solved while having a long-rech skill. How does that sound? (Forgot to sign ... Dark Morphon 17:04, 4 October 2007 (CEST))

Good Idea for Kinetic Armor. Gives nice survivability. I'll put it in variants for now. - Sommunn R 20:55, 4 October 2007 (CEST)

Woot! Enough votes to be putted in great! Way to go! Dark Morphon 13:04, 6 October 2007 (CEST)

Oh another suggestion: Change the name to Master of Daggers :P. That was how I called it when I posted it on the old site (where it became unfavored because of the retardness of the ppl there) Dark Morphon 13:48, 6 October 2007 (CEST)

I think someone else made a build called Master of Daggers after me. Also, This is only my second build I've put in testing and thank you all for your votes. - Sommunn R 18:04, 6 October 2007 (CEST)

Ooooh, NOW I see what every1 is talkign about xD. There is another crappy version of this build in trial and ppl think I'm talking bout that lol... Well I was talking about the Master of Daggers build which was nearly the same but got unfavored because of the retardness of the ppl there... Sorry for the confusion ppl ^^.

Dark Morphon 13:30, 7 October 2007 (CEST)

I get the idea that MoM " actually gives energy for each recharging skill that doesn't share the spell you cast's attribute", but since all the other skills are Deadly Arts ones why is MoM adding any energy at all? Kiteeye 05:34, 11 October 2007 (CEST)

MoM counts itself when you use a Deadly Arts skill. Also, the optional slot should be something other than a Deadly Arts skill meaning you'll receive 4 energy every cast. And Rez sig counts too so you'll get 6 energy if its used :)

۷ïεדИǺмЄŠЄ. 05:45, 11 October 2007 (CEST)

MoM gives energy from your two optional skills, Which are not Deadly Arts skills. - Jak123X 06:02, 11 October 2007 (CEST)

Wondering if I should add HA or GvG tag, since this could just serve as constant pressure or a ganker. - Jak123X 04:11, 16 October 2007 (CEST)

An idea, add glyph of sacrifice to one optional slot and any other skill in the other optional slot for AB. Helps with energy management.Ace 04:07, 17 October 2007 (CEST)

Paradox just got the nerfbat

It down to 33% faster regen fromm its 50%. Wonder if this build still works? --Hawk Skeer 15:32, 17 October 2007 (CEST)

It'll work. A small drop in speed like that (from one half to one third) won't kill the build. It's not as good, but still will work just fine. I think.Kwiet Oblivion 23:47, 17 October 2007 (CEST)

WHy can't you use shroud of distress with deadly paradox?Matti Nuke 08:13, 20 October 2007 (CEST)

You can, but then it recharges in 22.5 seconds, meaning you have to use it more often, meaning less dmg and energy. - Jak123X 23:41, 20 October 2007 (CEST)

Oh, I thought it meant not on the same bar... lol How does it affect damage though?Matti Nuke 02:43, 21 October 2007 (CEST)

If you use Deadly Paradox and Shroud of Distress, it lowers the recharge of Shroud of Distress, meaning you have to use it more often to fuel Master of Magic, meaning you're not killing things. Kamer 14:44, 21 October 2007 (CEST)

Glyph of Sacrifice and Meteor Shower would be cool, if u don't mind the exhaustion. Just more fuel for MoM. I think 90 seconds would be a good enough recharge, wouldn't it? Knockdowns would help in this build. The only downside is that there's no room for rez sig, making it the best to use in AB. Ace 01:20, 24 October 2007 (CEST)

A/E version?

Energy gain might not be so high but would this work with an Assassin? Would probably be good energy management for an Assassin Caster spamming Dancing Daggers while doing more damage and having a higher armour level. Unreal Havoc 02:54, 28 October 2007 (CET)

Nah, this kinda needs e-storage... that's the point of MoM, otherwise you may as well use E-Drain. ~~

frvwfr2 (T/C/Sysop) 03:18, 28 October 2007 (CET)

As it stands a minimum of 3 energy return per cast of Dancing Daggers? Dependant on other spells in the chain maybe 4 or 5? Can't be that bad? Unreal Havoc (talk*pvxcontribs) 03:21, 28 October 2007 (CET)

MoM's scaling is 0..2..2. At 0 energy storage it does nothing-channeling or such would be better for assassin primary. 69.40.242.12 21:56, 9 November 2007 (CET)

Name Change

I like the name Build:E/A Dancing Master better... lol, great huh? ~~ frvwfr2 (T/C/Sysop) 03:17, 28 October 2007 (CET)

Build:E/A Deadly MOM imo

۷ïεד • t/c 03:20, 28 October 2007 (CET)

That's pretty good too lol. ~~

frvwfr2 (T/C/Sysop) 03:25, 28 October 2007 (CET)

Dancing MOM to settle it? –Ichigo724

05:11, 28 October 2007 (CET)

Yeah, good enough. ~~

frvwfr2 (T/C/Sysop) 19:31, 28 October 2007 (CET)

I moved it from Dancing Mom to Dancing MOM. Dancing Mom is pretty misleading...---

Vinnie 22:42, 30 October 2007 (CET)

MOM = Master of Magic, for those who didn't know

+5e or 10%HSR?

I think 10%HSR would be better on your spear. It gives MoM a 30% chance to 2x recharge. 5e is meh, unless you use like E-Blast or something. ~~ frvwfr2 (T/C/Sysop) 19:28, 28 October 2007 (CET)

I'll go ahead and change it then. ~~

frvwfr2 (T/C/Sysop) 01:10, 29 October 2007 (CET)

Name

Great name lol. It makes me want to use it ^^ Ershin 20:41, 29 October 2007 (CET)

Deadly Paradox nerf

Now fifteen energy. Still viable? --71.229.204.25 03:27, 30 November 2007 (CET)

Yes, considering you have a 100+ energy pool. You make up cost of deadly paradox with MoM e-gain before it needs to be used again.

This is probably the only use of DP tht's left. Dark Morphon(contribs) 10:13, 1 December 2007 (CET)

Ritspike and IV spike... - Rawrawr 23:23, 4 December 2007 (CET)

?- Jak123X 00:56, 5 December 2007 (CET)

Energy

I find energy find... I don't know what the hell Shadowsin was running to only get 4 energy from it, mabye he ran the optionals blank...Paragon City 03:43, 5 December 2007 (CET)

[build prof=E/A Ener=12+1+1 Dead=12][Master Of Magic][Energy Blast][Deadly Paradox] [Augury of Death][Dancing Daggers][Entangling Asp][Signet of Toxic Shock][Resurrection Signet][/build] </pvxbig> I ran that bar, fyi and only got 4 energy per spell, also the fact that MoM has a 10 second down time, doesnt help your energy at all. w/o energy blast this thing is a damageless pile that is easily outhealed by the noobiest monk. This will never become meta and the energy loss from deadly paradox MoM and Energy blast kills your energy. --Shadowsin 03:48, 5 December 2007 (CET)

Energy wasn't the biggest problem either, i have never felt so useless when using an Ele before. I did hardly enough damage to be a threat, and was ignored for the better part of the battle to take out my stronger team mates. this is killer more fragile than the normal assacaster and that was fragile as it was.--Shadowsin 04:00, 5 December 2007 (CET)

Well, 3 recharging skills is nice to use this, and Shadowsin, your harsh vote (as usual) is appreciated. If only there were more of you on guildwars. - Jak123X 04:14, 5 December 2007 (CET)

I guess, i could remove E-Blast, since its 10 energy and recharges too soon. - Jak123X 04:15, 5 December 2007 (CET)

It would still need more damage. --Shadowsin 04:22, 5 December 2007 (CET)

Btw. MoM does not count it self and energy blast does not count either. "Recharging skills that do not share this spells attributes." --Shadowsin 04:25, 5 December 2007 (CET)

Btw. MoM means Spells that do not share attributes with the spell you cast...not with MoM...learn what a spell does before you vote on a build utilizing it... Guiltfeeder 07:45, 5 December 2007 (CET)

Oh kay then with only 2 skills from a different attrib + 4 energy per spell doesnt really help much. ~.~ seeing as DP is still taking away a large chunk of your energy every 13~ seconds. --Shadowsin 07:48, 5 December 2007 (CET)

DP = 15-11 energy every 13 seconds. Natural regen @ 4 pips = ~1 energy per second.

Not seeing the problem here. --71.229.204.25 07:54, 5 December 2007 (CET)

MoM also counts res sig as recharging...you can have 3 skills...giving you 6 energy everytime you use a spell...Even just spamming DD will give you a net gain of +1 every cast not including natural regen...this build has excellent e-manage...also it does do a decent amount of damage with a small spike. DD goes through stances/guardian and also PS and SB. Guiltfeeder 07:58, 5 December 2007 (CET)

On squishies maybe. It lacks power still. Even if you never run out of energy, Energy blast still requires some to be effective. I just tried it again, it lacks any substantial power, DD is subject to damage reduction by every class except maybe Eles themselves. Not to mention shadowstepping right to your target, while being mildly acceptable for a frontliner like an assassin, is suicide for a midliner like an ele. You are infact a squishy and with only one KD its really hard to stay alive.--Shadowsin 08:09, 5 December 2007 (CET)

Try having a prot monk (Which most in RA are i've found...) prot/heal through DD spam. Goes through giardian, goes through PS, goes through SB, RoF only stops one, what's left? WoH Spam / Dismiss spam for the measely ~70 heal. DD needs to be outhealed, and when doing ~90 damage every 2-3 seconds, and also gaining energy while you do it, makes this build very effective at pressuring targets. Not to mention DW and KD + SoTS "spike." Guiltfeeder 08:13, 5 December 2007 (CET)

Well seeing as i actually tested this build, and know its strenghs and weaknesses, damage being one of them, i realize this goes through prot monks prots. although how hard is it to heal a 15~ damage spam? AS far as the "Spike" is concerned it doesnt get them down to half health easily enough, unless they are an over extended squishy. --Shadowsin 08:16, 5 December 2007 (CET)

Considering the build is meant for RA...sometimes you dont have a monk to heal. A ~15dmg spam? How about a ~90 damage spam? DD spam is very good for pressure with the only downside being that you have to be in 1/2 range. Take Kinetic Armor... You'll be spamming anyway and the long recharge will help out with MoM. I don't think you realize how much pressure DD puts on a monk with it's short recharge/cast time...especially when combined with a KD (That you cant preprot before you're on the ground) and poison. Guiltfeeder 08:20, 5 December 2007 (CET)

I dont deny that it is good, for an assassin, as for an ele burning blinding weakness and other forms of spell spam might just be more effective, dont you think?--Shadowsin 08:32, 5 December 2007 (CET)

Considering the build is meant for RA, only crap players play ra monk without shield of absorption or shielding hands (guess why? anti monk stomping skills), easy prots that put to shame every dd spammer. --Jim Eno 08:56, 5 December 2007 (CET)

@@ Line 125: / Line 125: @@
 Considering the build is meant for RA...sometimes you dont have a monk to heal. A ~15dmg spam? How about a ~90 damage spam? DD spam is very good for pressure with the only downside being that you have to be in 1/2 range. Take Kinetic Armor... You'll be spamming anyway and the long recharge will help out with MoM. I don't think you realize how much pressure DD puts on a monk with it's short recharge/cast time...especially when combined with a KD (That you cant preprot before you're on the ground) and poison. [[User:Guiltfeeder|Guiltfeeder]] 08:20, 5 December 2007 (CET)
 :I dont deny that it is good, ''for an assassin'', as for an ele burning blinding weakness and other forms of spell spam might just be more effective, dont you think?--[[User:Shadowsin|Shadowsin]] 08:32, 5 December 2007 (CET)
+:Considering the build is meant for RA, only crap players play ra monk without shield of absorption or shielding hands (guess why? anti monk stomping skills), easy prots that put to shame every dd spammer. --[[User:Jimeno|Jim Eno]] 08:56, 5 December 2007 (CET)