Archive talk:Team - Shove Spike

Team - Shove Spike/Archive

Original moved to archive

Updated version ready for texting testing--Goldenstar 02:59, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

ups for talking to gf while doing wiki shit--Goldenstar 03:01, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

(EC) I fucking hate shove spike. Balanced should be able to beat it fairly easily with good tactics, and mind blast should blow it out of the water every time. Drahgal Meir 03:03, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Should we increase protection on LS to 12 for break point Pug pug 03:05, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Break point doesn't matter, you need to be able to clean spike with this build, and you need to be as mobile as possible in between spikes. Drahgal Meir 03:08, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Pretty sure you want more points in shadow arts for dark escape :/ Drahgal Meir 03:30, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

The question is "what is better? 35 health or 2 extra seconds on dark escape?" Remember the war has always only had 7 seconds and it has never seemed to be a big deal.(timcago 06:24, 10 July 2009 (UTC)).

Counters

I removed all the ones that used to be a counter against the warrior but no longer are due to Aegis, and added "monk" to the ones I think might still prevent the spike from killing if they do enough of it to the monks.(timcago 06:28, 10 July 2009 (UTC)).

Dear draghal

You're retarted. Can't whirling a war, he had aegis. Anyway just spike the war if you're having problems with getting people tele'd out. Spike skills are 3/4s, even for a good ranger, getting those isn't a guarantee. Chances are even a top notch ranger won't be able to get 2 rupts on spike every spike for 8:00 minutes. You're also under estimating the ability of this to fakespike and score kills vs eleway. You're not going to get a 40/40 on meteor every time they spike, so eventually a kill is going to get pushed through. You're right that this isn't perfect, but it's WAY better than 3-3-X--Goldenstar 06:47, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Also, there's ~1s after you res where you can't be bodyblocked, attacked, cast on etc--Goldenstar 06:52, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Even if 2 of the monks smites skills get rupted its still enough damage to kill. 58 times 12 = 696 damage + 71(shove) + 17(Crushing blow) + 15(hammer) + 120 (deep wound on 600 health) = 919 damage. So even if ranger rupts both of 1 monks smites its still 687 damage for the kill.(timcago 07:37, 10 July 2009 (UTC)).

It's possible to catch the spike with zero interrupts on anything, although blocking the DW helps a lot. Therefore it's way fucking easier to catch the spike if you rupt 2 monk smites, I would say jokingly easy, especially with how many people take Balanced Stance last I saw. That being said, this will make Shove Spike gayly effective, so I am glad I am not TAing at the moment. Enjoy your slow glad points and gay boring long-ass matches. Misery Says Moo 09:49, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

@Goldenstar, actually I'm pretty sure that's only when you get ressed from a shrine, not a sig. Drahgal Meir 15:38, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

grapple

Is it still necessary? Would distracting strike be better?(timcago 07:14, 10 July 2009 (UTC)).

If shove gets disabled then it is a good replacement skill so you can still spike Chi Shan 08:15, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

What the hell are you going to distracting strike? Misery Says Moo 09:50, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

How is shove going to get disabled? (well I suppose it could if you are really bad). Distracting strike has the same purpose as disrupting dagger. Grapple can still be used for small spikes though and there really isn't anything better to take that I can see o i guess it should stay(timcago 16:37, 10 July 2009 (UTC)).

Grapple is for standing spikes and fake spikes. Absolutely necessary--Goldenstar 16:56, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Carolina Liar

My shove is better than your shove tbh.74.75.91.253 15:32, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Stupid People

Shove didn't magically stop winning when it was archived, it has never stopped being incredibly effective when used by skilled players, such as myself. Aegis was never needed, and of course it isn't now. But for non-skilled teams, Aegis at least makes sure that you can get shove off, and it is useful in walkups when you can't double knock a ranger. I have no idea why anyone uses this Wikipedia would WANT HALF OF THE TEAMS IN TA TO BE MEDIOCRE SHOVE SPIKES. Why even bother putting this on the Wiki? It is obvious that skilled shove spikes never lose, and it is equally obvious that unskilled shove spikes lose to a RTL or hexway after eight wins. Leech Signet will still destroy a BAD shove, and so will Shock and Blackout.WeeMeeister 15:51, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

It was put on PvX because it's still ran and PvX exists for just that purpose - to store the current build that's being ran. Godbox 16:08, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

But why? If anyone here actually plays TA more than once a year, they would know that even a bad shove can still snap a streak. It certainly makes running anything else rather pointless, as you'll always end up getting your streak snapped by some random Shove spike.WeeMeeister 16:12, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

I usually run balanced in ta, and very rarely lose to shove spike. However, a few days ago my team lost on game 22 to shove spike and my ranger told me aegis was preventing him from stopping shove. I was like "wtf are you talking about" and then I read the new description for aegis and decided to post the new shove spike build here so that Arena net can realize the huge mistake they have made and nerf shove spike(hopefully smiters boon style). We lost 2 more runs that night to the same gay team.(timcago 16:34, 10 July 2009 (UTC)).

That was me, of course. You are a bad player, and by thinking that Aegis had a single thing to do with us beating you is very silly. Your ranger wouldn't have interrupted shove without Aegis.WeeMeeister 16:40, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

I would flawless you whether you took that shit or not, this build might be able to spike but apart from that its utter shit, and vega just farms bad players all day. Reunion 16:44, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Oh shit, a shove spiker called someone bad. Is he just going to take that? Misery Says Moo 16:47, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

"skill players, such as myself." lolpvx. ···  16:47, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Smites

do not need 16 prot, 15 is sufficent, take out DA for return, in various places if the war uses this

the war can HoS away from the monks, going up bridges etc. Edit: btw, return removes the counter of bodyblocking -- 00:40, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

noooooooo now arenanet will read this and nerf hos due to the mobility nooooooooooooo PWNAGEMUFFIN crabs 01:57, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

Yeah shovespike teams use HoS on the warrior for kiting and monks can return to warrior 68.108.169.4 04:22, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

well, HoS makes it tons slower compared to constant kiting EDIT: btw, wouldnt the prot smite taking RC and aegis, and the DH taking draw be better? -- 16:15, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

No guardian then =\ LS let's you get crips off faster which is really important in a kite build--Goldenstar 16:19, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

How to counter Shovespike and still win against other teams

Drahgal Meir 21:25, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

Nah, you will lose the the wiki version of balaned if you run that. So no one is going to.(timcago 03:35, 13 July 2009 (UTC)).

grasping earth fucks with them, just take your magebane with leech sig insted... 04:05, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

Protectors Defense

Just when you thought this build can't get any more overpowered someone thinks about using protectors defense... I mean omg, its not a stance so it wont cancel anything, and it gives all your monks a 75% chance to block against the ranger and warrior. This version of Shove also doesn't have to worry about cripple nearly as much because life sheath is 100 times more effective at removing it than restore conditions was(2 sec recharge 1/4 cast). Yall also figured out how to counter body blocking with Hof, and Return. This is disgusting!

I do have 1 complaint however. You should take a second look at Dark Escapes description, because not only does it allow you to run 25% faster, and gives a 50% chance to block, but it allows you to only take half damage which is extremely crucial against RTL spikers. Dark escape make RTL garbage and ensures that 2 equally skilled teams (one RTL one Shove Spike) will always make Shove spike the winner. I am not sure that is true anymore now that you have removed Dark escape. Realistically, no one is going to stop you from getting a kill making body blocking a fantasy because you need 4 people to body block effectively and if one of them is dead they are going to have to stop and rez and won't be able to get a kill on your team(timcago 04:06, 13 July 2009 (UTC)).