Talk: D/Me Dwayna UW Farmer

Discussion

3 Dervish UW solo farmers now. Anyone want me to make a farming build using a specific (usable in some way) elite? - (ăl zâr'ăs thĕ rē'pər)[snō hwīt tăn] 00:39, 17 February 2008 (EST)

Bump. Thoughts + votes? - (rĕ'küt ŏv ū'rūk)[snō hwīt tăn] 06:23, 22 February 2008 (EST)

Bump. It's easily accessible skills, unlike my other builds, so you should be able to test it sooner. So why aren't you? This is the easiest UW Derv build I've tried. - (nō'vĭk dăn tĕt')[snō hwīt tăn] 01:19, 26 February 2008 (EST)

Bumpedibump? Come on, show this thing some love! - (nō'vĭk dăn tĕt')[snō hwīt tăn] 05:57, 29 February 2008 (EST)

It's almost exactly like the build you linked to, replacing only 2 skills. Why not just put them as optionals and not make a whole new page for the same thing?

Feel free to make a UW/FoW farming guide for Dervishes if you want. - (ză'rē'năs thĕ shăd'ō)[snō hwīt tăn] 21:52, 10 March 2008 (EDT)

What? All I was saying is that there is no point in a whole new page for 2 skills..

This build just screams WELL. --Arthas 13:33, 10 March 2008 (EDT)

How so? - (ză'rē'năs thĕ shăd'ō)[snō hwīt tăn] 21:52, 10 March 2008 (EDT)

how will it counter the energy drain from the graspings?99.235.205.227 15:53, 10 March 2008 (EDT)

fear me nerf makes is easy, in fact makes it a non factor in killing the graspings68.91.95.34 15:57, 10 March 2008 (EDT)

I've been playing around with an AoD build for a few weeks now and I'll tell you why I haven't posted it.

There are two things that I don't like, and that is that A.)AoB accomplishes two things at once, armor boost and speed boost. AoD covers healing, but the healing and armor and movement speed increase that is needed to farm UW is more efficiently accomplished with AoB. With this build as is, you gain up to 86 hp per swing, and have 120 armor, after all is said and done. The AoB Build has 125 armor, 54 hp every time you swing your scythe, and 18hp/second from MR. You swing your scythe every 1.75 seconds, so 54 + (18x1.75)=85.5, rounded to 86hp. With AoB you have a little more armor, and although 5 AL doesn't make that much of a difference, the AoB build has Visages, which is the second reason I like it more.

With Visages, you drain the Grasping's energy, and are never interrupted, or have to worry about daze etc. Also, if you drain the Smite's energy, they can't use SoJ or RoF, which makes the run much faster. As I have stated in another post, it takes about 2 - 2.5 times as long to kill smites that spam RoF as it takes to kill Smites that have no energy from a visage.

So, there it is. I broke down all the numbers, and the AoB build has a few distinct advantages to this. AoB has 5 more armor, with the exact amount of healing (cool coincidence, eh?) and drains the energy of smites, for a faster and (marginally) safer run. I did all of these statistics and that is why I decided not to post the Dwayna build. Also, Smite Crawlers use Zealot's Fire, which, with this build, you have -22 armor against. Matti Nuke 20:31, 10 March 2008 (EDT)

While I agree that the AoB build (your build) is fast and safe, it's got something that I hate when I do UW runs: Enchant spam. Your fights are long enough, and your enchants are shortlived enough to force you to recast when fighting. And time and energy spent recasting could've been spent killing stuff instead. Which is why I always make my builds spam as little as possible. You should never cast your enchants more than once with my builds.

Also, I think your statement about the smites taking longer to kill when they spam RoF is a little off. In fact, with some of my builds (my SoJ build and my AoB build in particular) I've had the smites die much faster than with your AoB (this is not a personal attack, I like your AoB very much).

Interruption of enchantments against Graspings only happens if you don't know what you're doing (newb or noob), and with Mystic Sweep and Eremite's Attack, your attack skills will not get interrupted either. And with the nerf to "Fear Me!", that's no longer a threat.

This might just be my personal opinion, but I believe this is the easiest build for new UW farmers to pick up, as it has very high survivability, excellent speed and next to no enchant spam. Once they become more experienced farmers, they can start using your build, or any of my other builds for higher speed.

And just FYI, Mystic Vigor is pretty much all the self heal you need in UW, especially in your build. I suggest to bring some extra power instead of Mystic Regeneration (Heart of Fury, Aura of Holy Might, etc.). Just a suggestion :D - (ză'rē'năs thĕ shăd'ō)[snō hwīt tăn] 21:48, 10 March 2008 (EDT)

Also, please stop voting builds that aren't your AoB down. And don't say "See Riff's comment." on my SoJ build, as Riff is wrong. Peace - (ză'rē'năs thĕ shăd'ō)[snō hwīt tăn] 22:04, 10 March 2008 (EDT)

I'm not specifically voting your builds down because I didn't make them, I vote them after testing and seeing the effectiveness. I believe that Riff is right in his vote on the SoJ build. That is exactly what I was typing, when I saw his vote. To save me some time, however, I just said to see his. This build works good, but I have done extensive testing on Visages Vs. Rending Aura, and it is definitely slower. Test it with a stopwatch and see for yourself. Of all the builds on this site, however, this is the next best to the AoB build. Try this build using Visages, and see for yourself how much faster the smites drop. Lose Mystic Vigor and Rending Aura, then run the build again. I promise, you will see a speed increase in your runs. Make sure you have 8 (maybe 9) in illusion to meet the breakpoint for the 8 second Visages. This also gets a lower effectiveness because it can't kill coldfires, which you need to kill sometimes to get to the last few groups of smites.Matti Nuke 22:41, 10 March 2008 (EDT)

For your information, not being able to kill Coldfires is Universality, not Effectiveness, as this wasn't designed to kill them (read the description of the two). - (ză'rē'năs thĕ shăd'ō)[snō hwīt tăn] 23:15, 10 March 2008 (EDT)

For YOUR information, if you have to kill Coldfires to get to Smites, and you can't, then that means it hinders the effectiveness. ggMatti Nuke 00:03, 11 March 2008 (EDT)

Sorry, you're wrong. Effectiveness reflects the build's ability to do what it's designed to do: Kill Smites and Graspings and run past Aatxes. Universality is what reflects the ability for it to do that in light of unexpected situations. Having to kill something it wasn't designed to kill, for instance, would fall under that category. - zomg! PANIC! 05:32, 11 March 2008 (EDT)

My point. - (ză'rē'năs thĕ shăd'ō)[snō hwīt tăn] 05:35, 11 March 2008 (EDT)

This build was designed to kill smite crawlers, and either run past, or kill what is in your way to do so. Amirite? What happens to the last two groups of smites back around the castle? Just leave them? If this can't kill all of the smites this won't get a 5 in effectiveness.Matti Nuke 07:18, 11 March 2008 (EDT)

It says you can't kill Coldfires with it, so you shouldn't vote its Effectiveness down because it can't. That's why Universality is there. - zomg! PANIC! 07:20, 11 March 2008 (EDT)

Fine, it gets a 4 because it has less armor and gets interrupted. Satisfied? Also, Zealot's Fire > Physical Resistance.Matti Nuke 16:23, 11 March 2008 (EDT)

5 less AL unnoticeable and this doesn't get interrupted. Rending Aura = no Zealots Fire. Either change or remove your vote. - (ză'rē'năs thĕ shăd'ō)[snō hwīt tăn] 00:01, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

Wow, you're persistant. Alright, you guys said that since it can't kill coldfires that I rated universality too high? Fine, I'll lower it. Matti Nuke 08:25, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

IF YOU ARE TRYING TO KILL COLDFIRES WHILE FARMING IN UW, YOU DO NOT KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING. You can completely avoid every single coldfire mob as well as kill every single smite mob with this build. Do not lower your rating because you're trying to kill things this build was not designed to kill. The end.--Fallen (talk) 17:27, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

Innovation

This criterion describes how new the idea behind the build is. Not new at all. Look at this and see that there are only two skills changed. Does it use a new approach for dealing with a known task or even act as a precursor for dealing with a previously unconsidered task? No, it follows the "Avatar of (Insert choice god) UW Farming build template. Avatar, Eternal Aura, Mystic Vigor, Armor, 2 attack skills, enchant removal skill. Nothing new at all. To what extend is it expected to become a prototype for a new class of builds? It follows the prototype that was established in October by the D/Me UW Smite Solo, so again, nothing new. After seeing this, how are people rating 3s for innovation? To pad your vote? lrn2read&vote plox.Matti Nuke 15:06, 14 March 2008 (EDT)

Lol@you. First of all, your build didn't set a standard. If anything, this set the standard for UW Melee farming. Does that mean every other UW melee farmer should be voted down? No. Secondly, there is no "Avatar of (Insert choice god)" farming template. This is the second build of its kind submitted to this wiki. How's that following a template? And even if it did follow a template (that has been proven to work), should it be voted down? No, case in point. Would you please stop voting dervish farmers down just because they aren't the D/Me UW Smite Solo. - (ză'rē'năs thĕ shăd'ō)[snō hwīt tăn] 22:24, 14 March 2008 (EDT)

Lol@you. If you follow real vetting, all of them aren't "voted down", they're voted correctly. People think "oh, this is a "great" build, so I will pad the Innovation to make sure it gets in the "Great" category." Which is wrong. It could work great, but if its a copy, with only two skills changed from another build, it is not innovative, and therefore innovation shouldn't be voted high. When did I say my build set a standard? Don't remember ever typing that. I can see 5 UW derv farmers, so where do you get "Second of it's kind" from? Matti Nuke 00:32, 15 March 2008 (EDT)

Don't follow RV when it comes to Innovation, just put it proportional to Effectiveness. — Skadiddly[슴Mc슴]Diddles 00:33, 15 March 2008 (EDT)

ah, screw it. Matti Nuke 00:35, 15 March 2008 (EDT)

We're working on getting it changed (since about 6 months ago >.>) — Skadiddly[슴Mc슴]Diddles 00:38, 15 March 2008 (EDT)

(EC) You count 5 UW farmers, but how many of them are "Avatar, Eternal Aura, Mystic Vigor, Armor, 2 attack skills, enchant removal skill"? 3, of which this was the second build to be submitted. You said your build was the standard when you said this: "It follows the prototype that was established in October by the D/Me UW Smite Solo". If RV was to be followed to the letter on Innovation, many great builds, such as the ones I mentioned above, would be rated lower because they "follow a template". Fortunately, most people have the brains to more or less ignore the Innovation category and instead give the build the rating they believe it deserves. - (ză'rē'năs thĕ shăd'ō)[snō hwīt tăn] 00:42, 15 March 2008(EDT)

And, ladies and gents, this is the definition of vote padding. Okay tell me this then. Does it use a new approach for dealing with a known task or even act as a precursor for dealing with a previously unconsidered task? If not from the D/Me build, where did the inspiration come from to make this build? Answer that, don't avoid it.Matti Nuke 00:45, 15 March 2008 (EDT)

Don't worry, I'll wait patiently.Matti Nuke 00:46, 15 March 2008 (EDT)