Build talk:Team - 2 Man Physical Support

Not sure about the last bar but laumclazy. - AthrunFeya - 12:38, January 28, 2010 (UTC)

Looks ok to me except maybe PoD. Recharge is a little high imo. Spaggage talk 13:04, January 28, 2010 (UTC)

I take ER protter for HM.--ValeV 14:20, January 28, 2010 (UTC)

Not a huge fan of relying on my henchies for healing. I like the regular setup more :o Life Guardian 17:05, January 28, 2010 (UTC)

This does have some healing - and lets be honest the monk hench are probably the better choice of all of them (strong warriors, lol). Taking N.Rt over N/mo is also in variants. - AthrunFeya - 11:08, January 29, 2010 (UTC)

Herta is win! Also, I'm not sure about Weaken Armor seeing as you have all the armor ignoring buffs anyway. Drop it for another prot, maybe SoA? Spaggage talk 11:15, January 29, 2010 (UTC)

All the melee damage you do will still be effected by armor.

• / Splinter Bot Hero

• / Orders Dervish Hero

• / Curses Spammer Hero

hmmm - AthrunFeya - 11:17, January 29, 2010 (UTC)

I know it will but with all the rest of the buffs, stuff will be exploding anyway and it just seems overkill is what I was trying to say. No prots? =/ Spaggage talk 11:27, January 29, 2010 (UTC)

Think about it. Stuff like PS and blocking are less necessary on physicals, you could just adjust your build slightly. - AthrunFeya - 11:35, January 29, 2010 (UTC)

Oh. I have a better idea. - AthrunFeya - 11:36, January 29, 2010 (UTC)

Looks good to me. Spaggage talk 12:17, January 29, 2010 (UTC)

^This has pretty much everything I'd want in a hero team as a physical. ToraenTheJanitor 12:31, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

The D/N will be kinda useless though if one or both of the humans are using scythes (AoHM). There should probably be a variant build for that. ToraenTheJanitor 13:28, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

No. It's useless either way. Orders dervs shine on physical teams. Last time I checked this team has only two of them. -.- Way to waste skillslots. This is hardly "physicalway" at all. Not to note that half these bars are terrible. Who's dicks did she suck to become BM at some point anyway?

Ah good old IPs, always flaming, never signing. Oh superior anonymous contributer, what do you suggest for these skill bars that have been cruelly deprived of your wisdom and endless understanding? Spaggage talk 15:19, January 29, 2010 (UTC)

Eat me spaggage :P Your superior sarcasm nearly escaped me. Too bad your buildwars isn't the same level as your sarcasm skills.

Ups, I got BM from contributing highly to most of the elite areas meta builds and tactics. Also half the bars (well all but 1 of the bars) are already on PvX rated Great in the hero section, frankly making your opinion in the minority I'm afraid to say. It is true though that is isn't really physicalway - it's more 2 man physical support heroes. Although Derv Orders isnt at its maximum efficiency by only having two physicals in the party, this team isn't exactly lacking anything else and to be perfectly honest Orders Derv will always be better than any attempt to make a melee hero. - AthrunFeya - 16:09, January 29, 2010 (UTC)

Wow. Cryways and teams filled with perma slivers. Those are really hard to make. You so good! I apologise, that BM status was obviously deserved after all, and obviously not from sucking dick. My point about the bars being bad wasn't about them being on here already in great (lovely of you to hide behind that label though), it was about you taking them out of the great section and altering them in such a way that they are worse. Elite enchantment removal for pve?! Come on!! Necros have tons of other elites that would be so much better. Or an elite from a secondary prof even. And that is just one example out of many. I also find it funny that you actually agree with me on the orders derv but cba to think of something better to put in your team.

Well as of yet you've not shown you can think of anything better either, same story goes for the 'tonne of other' necro elites. When we hear these illusive skills then I'll start taking you seriously (or loose all regard, which is usually the case). However, until then your claims hold no regard but well done on your cute attempt at trolling. Inb4 'ur terrible if you don't know what skills i'm talking about' - just a pretty stupid way of sidetracking the fact you have no grounds to base your arguments on. - AthrunFeya - 17:35, January 29, 2010 (UTC)

Orders bar

Should the E/N replace the D/N? This team doesn't really need the D/N's healing (two sets of rit heals, party healing and hex removal on the MM, prots on the curser, possibility of SY on players), and being able to spec into earth wards or free up slots on the N/Rt resto is interesting. It also has Awaken the Blood for slightly stronger orders. ToraenTheJanitor 23:02, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

^ yes basically. want to do it for me? - AthrunFeya - 23:08, January 31, 2010 (UTC)

this looks like a random assortment of builds, you could just as well use sabway or discord. i would just list the e/n and rt/mo and barbs/mop can go on a necro from sabway or discord--Relyk _talk 00:45, February 1, 2010 (UTC)

^ tbh. 2 player hero builds don't seem very useful to me. Just reduce it to a 1 player/3 hero build...unless this is for a specific area. I hate 2 player + hero builds unless they're for an elite area. They just seem pointless. Karate Jesus 00:51, 1 February 2010

2 man 6 hero is quite common. just look on guru at the people requesting vanquishing partners, this is why. - AthrunFeya - 01:12, February 1, 2010 (UTC)

The only people I've ever seen looking for VQ partners are guys with new Guru accounts (which means they're probably bad at the game or new to it). It's so easy to VQ with just hench + 3 heroes that I don't know why people would bother. And when most people do they just c+p 2 discordways or make up their own shit. Karate Jesus 02:47, 1 February 2010

maybe i've spent too long afking in shitter pve guilds then. - AthrunFeya - 02:50, February 1, 2010 (UTC)

Or it could just be me, but I've never seen the point of 2-man VQ'ing unless the area is really difficult....and there aren't many of those in GW. Karate Jesus 02:51, 1 February 2010

The only real points to it are to have someone else to talk to on the mic who's sorta on the same page as you and to get the area done a little faster (significantly faster if you split, but this build doesn't do that, and splitting might not be viable everywhere). ToraenTheJanitor 01:06, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

Imbagon + 100b/WW warrior

Jesus christ, game over. this build is the fist of god. ▲ɐʇoɯısʞ▲ 17:25, February 19, 2010 (UTC)

I'm an imbagon and my girlfriend just picked up the game and is playing a Warrior. This is gonna be a total shitstorm in a months time :-) 59.100.65.191 11:11, March 27, 2010 (UTC)

Corrupt

Is it really needed? I mean, do PvE monsters have that much enchantments you want them to get rid of anyway? (asides from Afflicted Azzzazzzzzzzzzzzzzinzzzzzzzzz, but you can't remove SF with Corrupt anyway) Brandnew 17:29, February 19, 2010 (UTC)

good alternative? - AthrunFeya - 18:25, February 19, 2010 (UTC)

That's what I was thinking. You might be able to get away with WoR+Rip, idk. Brandnew 00:54, February 20, 2010 (UTC)

oh, i meant good alternative elite ;p - AthrunFeya - 00:59, February 20, 2010 (UTC)

Going to use the: 'friday night, just went to a bar, semi-drunk' excuse. Believe i've still got some off those to claim for this year. --Brandnew 01:11, February 20, 2010 (UTC)

IV is like the only other thing useful--Relyk _talk 01:16, February 20, 2010 (UTC)

doesn't IV deal like, 6 damage? --Brandnew 01:19, February 20, 2010 (UTC)

But it's to all nearby foes!!! Spaggage talk 01:55, February 20, 2010 (UTC)

The second healer has no reason to be Rt primary, the interrupts are cute and all, but N/Rt have better ene management without the need to have loads of spellcasters around them. 78.1.70.132 22:54, March 1, 2010 (UTC)

Interrupts are actually useful to have. You can sub it out if you don't need interrupts for a particular area. ToraenTheJanitor 23:30, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

They're useful but the way most AI casters work is - cast AoE (usually slower casting spells) at the start of a fight, your Rt interrupts them and basically gets no energy back since he/she is usually at max before a fight starts anyways. The optimal utilization of this character would be to start interupting after he's healed the initial damage (when he actually needs the energy) but as far as I know heroes just go and rupt whatever they can asap. 83.131.52.227 17:54, March 2, 2010 (UTC)

The interrupts do recharge mid-fight if it lasts long enough to cause energy problems, so the hero only runs out of energy if you're really straining the healing abilities of 2 rit healers (pretty hard to do with all the defense in this setup). I've run that hero several times in place of an N/Rt in a 3-hero setup with good results. ToraenTheJanitor 23:56, 2 March 2010 (UTC)

you could use energy drain over tease, as it suggests. - AthrunFeya - 00:43, March 3, 2010 (UTC)

I think an ER protter with some hex removal would be a better choice then the necro healer Notorious BW 21:48, March 24, 2010 (UTC)

There's already 2 hex removals in the build, but that's a decent option. You'd also get to use the free slots on the SS necro for something like command. ToraenTheJanitor 22:52, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

Orders

are kind of wasted with only two physicals. If Heroes were good with Barrage, I'd suggest it, but this evidently isn't the case. Incendiary Arrows with Quickening Zephyr might actually work out, because QZ also reduces the recharges of all of your Energy management skills (SoLS, Inspiration interrupts), among other benefits (Ether Renewal, Aegis, Jagged Bones, Mark of Pain). You'd likely want to put SoLS on your MM's bar, though. An Earth Shaker hero could also work, assuming heroes won't find a way to fuck that up, too. Finally, Corrupt Enchantment (use a non-Elite), Barbs (long casting time) and SS (iffy) aren't worth it, imo. Oh, and, Hundred Blades Warriors. ــѕт.мıкε 00:31, March 20, 2010 (UTC)

Nvm about the Elites; your choices blow, anyway. >.> ــѕт.мıкε 02:12, March 20, 2010 (UTC)

Youre welcome to suggest something better. I (nor anyone else) have thought of anything better to replace them. Also now anet have buffed half the skills in the orders bar, it does a lot more than a bit of extra damage for your phys chars. - AthrunFeya - 14:18, March 20, 2010 (UTC)

This and this are what I've got so far. I realized the inconvenience of Quickening Zephyr, so I made the second version. Basically, the ER Orders and Splinter/SoH Bot can be merged into/onto one bar, with Splinter and Ancestors' moved into/onto another bar. Generally, I try to get two copies of Splinter Weapon, Ancestors' Rage, Mark of Pain and Aegis on every team (that has physicals, including Minions). Weapon of Remedy is still pretty meh as an Elite, but I couldn't think of anything better that could also take Splinter+A-Rage, MoP, or Aegis on its bar (the Rt/Me doesn't have the room). Also, Heroes are apparently excellent with Infuse, so there's no harm in keeping one copy, even with low Healing Prayers (250-321 is a big Heal).

Another way to approach this is name all of the skills we absolutely want in the build, and try to work around that. ــѕт.мıкε 16:54, March 20, 2010 (UTC)

V3: it's starting to look better. XD ــѕт.мıкε 05:27, March 21, 2010 (UTC)

Any thoughts? I think I've got something decent (slightly more efficient than this in terms of useful Elites and bar compression). Destruction+Destruction+Feast of Souls seems like it could be interesting on Heroes for AoE spike damage+party heal, although, of course, timing might not work out, but ideally, that's 150 in the area damage every ~10 seconds. ــѕт.мıкε 02:07, March 28, 2010 (UTC)

Err, most of those bars are pretty bad. Life Guardian 02:09, March 28, 2010 (UTC)

Explain. The only bar that isn't standard for PvE is the SoS Rit because it's between Build:Rt/any SoS Channeling Rit and Build:Rt/Me SoS Restoration Rit. To not use SoS as fodder for FoS is an insult to the skill (forcing you to go /Me for MoI), and Destruction is pretty decent now. The Smiter is forced to take Blessed Signet to maintain SoH on 3 allies, but then again, Smiters don't have that much to do in the first place (recharge on Ray of Judgment). The only two things that I think are really missing are extra rez and a spike heal (Infuse or Spirit Transfer), which I'm still looking for ways to fit in. Barbs, Shield of Absorption, Blood Bond, Mark of Fury, Infuse Condition, Weapon of Warding (because of Dual Aegis, instead) and Recovery are all either wastes or just not that useful. ــѕт.мıкε 02:45, March 28, 2010 (UTC)

Attrib spread on RoJ is horrific. Blessed sig is terrible. You said Shield of Absorption is bad, which makes you bad. MM doesn't need SoLS. Heroes can't manage 2 pots, and destruction should never really be of use(not to mention you have 2 of them, unless heroes will cast on recharge regardless of if one is up). Using feast of souls is an insult to SoS's damage capabilities, and hex eater sig will cause massive ai bugs(eg, running up to frontline to remove hexes). Heroes can't prioritize balled foes, so erf shakur is somewhat subpar. Even then, lolbellysmash. Life Guardian 03:05, March 28, 2010 (UTC)

The RoJ would heal for shit, even with DF and Smiter's Boon (it only has Smite Hex to heal allies with), so it isn't worth the investment in DF; I put the points somewhere else, without any significant loss. If you insist that the MM doesn't need SoLS, I'll drop it for Shield of Absorption, but with so many allies (Minions, mostly) and two copies of Aegis, you can't expect your allies to take lots of small damage. It could be useful for AoE, but seeing as you've got two physical players, one copy of "Save Yourselves!" won't be too hard to manage. SoS, on its own, deals 36 DPS, destroying the Spirits to save your party isn't a big deal, although, to have PWK and PWML on separate bars, I can drop the Destructions, FoS, MoI and Hex Eater Signet (although from Hex Eater Signet: "Heroes will favor allies who are nearby with Hex Eater Signet."), and put some Resto on the SoS's bar instead. The point of Destruction was that, when destroyed by FoS, it could be resummoned (by the other Hero) right after. They won't resummon them to kill them, but if they die early, they'll be replaced. I'll make the Earth Shaker optional; the build will be even more flexible, then. ــѕт.мıкε 14:44, March 28, 2010 (UTC)

Obviously youve never played a phys char properly or you'd know they take a lot of small damage packet - SoA is very useful. 91.154.106.127 14:47, March 28, 2010 (UTC)

I understand that, but you missed my argument: "If you insist that the MM doesn't need SoLS, I'll drop it for Shield of Absorption, but with so many allies (Minions, mostly) and two copies of Aegis, you can't expect your allies to take lots of small damage. It could be useful for AoE, but seeing as you've got two physical players, one copy of "Save Yourselves!" won't be too hard to manage." So, when most of your team members have 160+ armor and 50% blocking, while Bone Minions have less 60 and are of low level, they'll be taking the most damage, which is what you want. ــѕт.мıкε 14:55, March 28, 2010 (UTC)

how does that make the fact you, as a phys char, should be the one to first aggro all foes any different? Jump into mobs (preferably with death's charge and iau on), slap soa on and watch stuff die in a whirlwind of splinter weapon. 91.154.106.127 15:48, March 28, 2010 (UTC)

You're describing a tank; this is a Hero Team build, and, again, you've got tons of Minions that will keep Monsters from targeting you. Either way, here's V4, modified to please Life Guardian, and SoA is an option on the MM's and the RoJ's bars. ــѕт.мıкε 15:57, March 28, 2010 (UTC)

Hi Lau! l2p mike. Life Guardian 20:14, March 28, 2010 (UTC)

User:St._Michael/sandbox#2_Man_Physicalway_4. I've corrected just about everything you've criticized. ــѕт.мıкε 20:24, March 28, 2010 (UTC)

Wasn't talking about the build there. I was talking about how you reacted when the best way to play a physical was described. Oh, and i really don't see a reason for pwwlm, spirit transfer, or gaze from beyond. Heroes also glitch when using GoLE, and won't cast 5 energy spells. Life Guardian 20:39, March 28, 2010 (UTC)